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Forums » Discussions » Tactics and Techniques » Realism of Crouching/Kneeling
Realism of Crouching/Kneeling
RyeDate: Monday, 2014-02-17, 13:17 | Message # 21
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Crouching is game limitations in a bundle. In reality you can effectively 'sneak' while in an upright position, crouching makes little difference to noise profile, terrain analysis and movement. It makes a difference to your visual signature, that's about it. But in games of course somehow it makes you a sneaky ninja.

Confirmatory bias will tell you if you look around you will find people crouching in reality, well of course! As demonstrated though they are not Military or Police. They are civilians. Airsofters, paintballers, gamers. This is nothing to go on for trying to emulate S.W.A.T. for example.

This isn't to say that crouching is not conducted, it is. As is snailing and turtling, which was used heavily in Fallujah. But where exactly? When applicable. Windows that you need to duck under because the situation has not gone dynamic yet as another example. You will not see Counter-Terrorist teams do this often unless it is on approach. You will hardly see teams do this in a doorway or during an entry unless it is a short room they are clearing from the door.

TLDR: Crouching is unrealistic unless it is very specific in nature. Room entries do not crouch, you rush the room typically which means you are upright.
 
SAS_MasterDate: Monday, 2014-02-17, 16:42 | Message # 22
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Crouching during dynamic operations can also be used to overcome hitbox deficiencies in games like raven shield, swat 4 and takedown (ARMA not so much, given the focus on open area infantry combat). Come under fire? Crouch, so you greatly reduce the chance of having your coverman accidently plink you in the back of the head with a 9mm round because the game says your coverman is aiming inside your hitbox. Same thing with throwing grenades or deploying breaching devices. Getting a flashbang boinked against your head is never fun due to the throw hitting the not-quite-perfect hitbox around your character whilst standing.

Message edited by SAS_Master - Monday, 2014-02-17, 16:44
 
RaptorDate: Monday, 2014-02-17, 17:29 | Message # 23
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That was one of my main concerns as well Master. But actually it's not that much of an issue in Swat4 and TD, if you are careful enough with your aiming. (Unless someone has very ugly teleporting lags...)

@Rye: yea, games like Swat4, RvS or TD really fail to simulate real body positions and movements. Makes it kinda hard to act in a realistic way within these game mechanics concerning crouching and movement speed sad


"Teamwork is essential, it gives them someone else to shoot at."
Murphy's Laws of Combat #9


Message edited by Raptor - Monday, 2014-02-17, 17:32
 
RyeDate: Saturday, 2014-02-22, 06:25 | Message # 24
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No worries, fully understand the engine limitations. It's a real shame. It's like SWAT 4 with moving at any speed, the accuracy decrease to an unreasonable proportion and dispersion alone makes your true abilities look like a fraud. SSF for example makes this a tonne better.
 
RaptorDate: Thursday, 2014-03-06, 10:10 | Message # 25
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I finally added a paragraph to our Swat4 game hints:

Quote
In real life a crouching or kneeling position is rarely used in CQB, in particular while moving. Players should keep that in mind. However due to the limited game mechanics it’s quite hard to achieve a really realistic behaviour in this aspect.


"Teamwork is essential, it gives them someone else to shoot at."
Murphy's Laws of Combat #9
 
RaptorDate: Tuesday, 2014-04-15, 07:47 | Message # 26
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Found a documentation that shows, what we try to simulate with crouched, stealth movements in Swat4 (audio is in German, but it's not important anyway): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sATJLa-Hluw#t=23m25s

"Teamwork is essential, it gives them someone else to shoot at."
Murphy's Laws of Combat #9
 
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